I really like these, but I’m curious what a 1L would look like.
I’ve said right from when RTD was first discussed, the beauty of powder is being able to mix the exact kcal you want and it just doesn’t make as much sense to prescribe a meal size with RTD. It’d be muuuuuch better to have 1L tetrapacks with maybe 12000kcal in them each.
I would totally buy these! Much more efficient storage . As someone who decants my Huel powder into tupperware containers as soon as I get them it’s actually quite annoying pouring all the dregs into the containers without powder ending up everywhere. Currently I tend to ignore the ziplock seal completely and just cut the bottom of the bags open and pour from that end instead as it works better that way.
I discussed the possibilities of powder compression/vacuum packing with the guy at Huel who deals with pack development and it seems a no go -
“We have investigated, but because of how ‘fluffy’ Huel is when it is manufactured, it is actually far more difficult than we’d like. When a Huel pouch is filled, it is actually filled to the brim, its only in the days after it that it settles down to the state you receive it in. The extra space is usually air pockets, so to compress, you would have to suck air out from powder. To cut a long story short, this “un-blends” Huel. Same thing if we press it too much, if can shift stuff around, although this has more potential. However, getting a big press into the production right now isn’t likely viable.”
BTW – storing Huel powder in Tupperware is not ideal unless its completely opaque and/or stored in a dark cupboard.
Like this…
The tapered shape of the Top Base models is much more pronounced on the 1000ml carton and Base is the only format offered in 1000ml.
@Phil_C you are very good at what you do. I want those matcha cartons more than I can describe. The power of graphic design!!
thats the good thing about adopting a ‘sqround’ format you get the same volume of liquid in a pack only 3-4mm wider than the slimline bottle and >30% shorter.
There’s shed loads of inaccurate and outdated info on the environmental impact of Tetra Pak’s – what may have been true a decade or more ago, isn’t today, the carbon footprint of these packs is WAY smaller than a PET alternative – for example – the Base 500ml pack has a cradle to grave footprint of 22 g CO₂/pack. A 500ml PET bottle has 82.8g per 500ml bottle. This design also reduces freight volume by around 17-18% which further improves that figure.
I’d much prefer this, i would just move the powder into a plastic tub. Huel being shipping in a none recyclable bag to me is not acceptable. What about Can’s ? Old Army ration packs used to have big cans/tins of powered Milk.
I totally agree… for those that consume Huel regularly, the bag is not the best choice. And also the amount per unit could be higher.
My friend gets his protein powder in handy little packages like this, fantastic for storage, and minimal waste, perhaps we could look into it?
Hahahaha 
Do you have his number, I have a big weekend planned lol
They are working with industry suppliers on new materials but last I heard with development and testing that’s at least a year away. All of these multi layer type packaging bags and pouches require specific recycling workflows that so far in the UK and Europe have been glacially slow at rolling out to full commercialisation despite the fact it is a very common packaging type.
Many brands are ramping up trials of easily recyclable aluminium packaging to replace plastic – while aluminium cans might indeed mean less ocean waste, they come with their own problems - the production of each can pumps about twice as much carbon into the atmosphere as each plastic bottle – not to mention the ecological disaster that is bauxite mining to make the aluminium.
Comparing the carbon footprints of aluminium and plastics is a complex calculation because making the metal with hydropower instead of fossil fuels reduces emissions but when all types of metal are averaged out, however, it still accounts for about double the greenhouse gases of plastic bottles.
At aluminium’s most polluting level, a 330 ml can is responsible for 1,300 grams of carbon dioxide emissions, roughly equating to the emissions produced by driving a car 7 to 8 km. A plastic bottle of the same size, made from the polyethene terephthalate accounts for up to 330 grams.
While Aluminium could well carve out a niche in plastics replacement it is unlikely to sweep the board anytime soon, if ever. Simple economics is a major factor - aluminium is more expensive than plastic - the raw material cost is about 25-30% higher than PET.
Did they ever make any changes based on these suggestions? It seems sqround bottles are the way to go. They are a lower height, meaning they take less space and consequently reduce packaging. Thanks to Phil for these great mockups.
We’re not looking at a new bottle shape for our RTD. Creating a new bottle mould costs hundreds of thousands of dollars, we are limited by what our manufacturers can use on their lines. We’ve only just reached some level of continuity with our RTD manufacturer. I realise that’s boring, sorry. Changing the bottle is not simple!
These were literally just a personal pack development exercise I did to stop me going mad while I was on medical leave some time back, that then sort of morphed into playing around with branding and colours and all sorts of other bits and pieces.
I understand. Maybe this could be a good experiment sometime in the future when you have resources to play around with. The advantage is you won’t need as tall of a box to package it in. Maybe it would allow other products to go in the same box along with the RTDs. Who knows? You guys already put good effort into sustainability as it is.
You’re quite knowledgable about recycling and packaging. It was an interesting concept and a good read.
Hi @Phil_C, just went through the thread. Seems epic.
In terms of cap discussion, just in case this is something you haven’t seen, this brand claims to have a rather optimised resealable water cap. Not sure if relevant for Huel.
@Tim_Huel we get that it’s not as easy as slightly altering the Huel mix, especially given your current worldwide operation (that I hugely benefit from), but I guess this could be a suggestion for long-term horizon (coming decades?). Nicer packed bottles seem to make sense, though I don’t use them, whilst I definitely wondered, why the bags arrive with head-space and what to do with the empty ones. If there will be a consideration in the future to offer “refills” in larger/less glamorous packs at lower cost you can be sure to have a customer-base support. I am not sure if it will affect the branding too much as it is usually the shaker people see…
Likewise, I am sure there might be a way to simulate the “settling” of Huel in a bag outside of the bag if this would somehow save you storage space and transportation costs down the line although I have no idea about the latter.
That is a real shame.
I already decant my bags into an opaque tin which ends up with much less mess on a day-to-day basis. Larger opening, no static effect. I expect more people would do this if, has been mentioned in the thread, it was easy to find suitable containers. Most food containers are see-through plastic. I ended up buying a tin intended for flour. Ideally I was going to buy a stainless steel drum intended for rice but they are surprisingly hard to purchase online this country.
I was particularly interested in the idea of blocks of Huel. I tend to order 4 or 6 bags at a time to save money, transport, and time (one delivery to be home for). It turns out these are shipped in inadequate packaging (for the courier choice - DPD has a penchant for crushing boxes) and so far out of 3 shipments, 2 have had a burst bag inside. I only realised recently when buying a colleague’s excess order that the boxes for shipping 2 bags are actually properly robust! I just wish that was the case for larger shipments.
If there was a way to sell the Huel in a more tightly packed form (no air to pop the container) it would have this additional benefit on top of the environmental benefits.
Is Huel a uniquely ‘fluffy’ powder? How do flour manufacturers/packagers do it? Surely there must be an existing product with similar properties for which this problem has been solved?
(This is the container I really wanted but it went unavailable as I was trying to make my mind up: https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B07R51PY6R)
I have seen terrorists hide uranium in containers like that one.
But I totally agree. I also hate the static effect, its a minor issue but its messy. I think Tim explained why the the vacuum pack is problematic and difficult, but I am also sure that new form of package is the future of this market, much more efficient to carry, store and distribute
flour is much denser and less aerated I guess - if you notice similar products to Huel that come in plastic pots - they too appear only partially filled when you open them as the product has settled a lot. Compressing the powder is an option but it would require some major changes in the packing lines.
The kind of canister you were looking at seems good a bit like the coffee grounds containers that also have gas barriers.
I’m not sure it is really - regarding the bottle designs I did, the last versions I did did away with retooling and instead utilised a current standard pack format (TetraPak Top) that stuck with the ‘sqround’ shape and dimensions but not a custom design. By this point they had definitely migrated more into pack redesign exercises rather than investigating pack development itself further for the reasons Tim gave.
