Thanks for raising this @Kestrel, it’s great that you’re educating yourself. This issue has come up before and we have tested for BPF and BPS for our shaker. You’ll be glad to know all the samples tested came back with ‘not detected’ results.
The issue is also what would the alternative packaging be? For example, glass breaks easily and has a significantly higher carbon footprint than plastic. Metal has a much higher carbon footprint too and runs into issues around pollutants in the supply chain. Phil has done a useful post here around stainless steel.
You of course can use alternatives. Like blending Huel and pouring into a glass, this obviously removes a lot of convenience but I can’t think of many other ways to get around this? H&S you can obviously use a ceramic bowl.
Most blenders use plastic jugs so you would still be “exposing” the Huel to the plastic in the blending process before pouring it into a glass.
The water which we all drink from the tap is delivered via metal (copper I think) pipes. If you leave water in a pipe long enough it turns orange. Obviously it would then be dangerous to drink. So in theory at least, the water we drink could contain metal deposits. I think you have to draw the line somewhere or you would go crazy.
No need to worry about that! You already get your dose of lead from eating or drinking out of glazed ceramics
Your crockery leaches out all sorts of nasties into your food or drink when its heated or damaged and glazes can include mixes of:
And if you’re using any family China from the early 20th Century – possibly even Uranium. The heavy metals in particular are very toxic and bioaccumulate but sure, lets worry about plastics instead and toss them into a landfill - because that helps.
Interesting topic. If you browse long enough you will find research highlighting contaminents everywhere. Where do you draw the line. Many of these studies conclusions are based from data that does not always relate directly to humans but are inferred to have a negative affect based on other species . Also the measurement parameters can vary widely from ppm to picocgrams. Many studies indicate RDA of vitamins, minerals protein etc. are given in milligrams (mg.). These values are also influenced by other factors such as age, weight and such. You get the picture. You have to draw the line and use common sense and do what you believe is right for you.
This is very true, our skin only disperses about 40% of the chemicals it comes into contact with and absorbs the rest – so a journey in your car will probably mean you absorb as much if not more from the polycarbonates and polyurethanes on the dash/handles/wheel etc as you would from leaching into your food from a poorly made container.
absolutely not - its just ‘a’ option - unfortunately there are ups and downs for any material choice you as a consumer make and every type also so has some sort of manufacturing consequence down the line.
Agreed - absolutely consumers should use whats the best fit for them and the best way to do that is a bit of research and weighing up the pros and cons - not by demonising one thing and assuming everything else is better.
Hi @Tristan I like the idea of your glass shaker but it would have to be quite tough glass for me. I no what you mean about having too many shakers though. I do like the new shaker design and I am really surprised that I have not lost the lid yet.
All drinking water contains trace metal deposits. Without the impurities in the water, including the metals, we couldn’t survive. Our kidneys aren’t designed to process ultrapure water and they need the natural impurities.
I’m not sure what your pipes are made of, but water contaminated with copper will turn blue. Orange water could be caused by iron contamination. Iron is a heavy metal - if your water is orange contact your water authority or a competent plumber immediately.
Both plastic and metal pipes are used in the water supply - many underground metal water pipes have been replaced with more durable plastic ones in my area in recent months.
A list of chemicals that sound ominous is pretty useless if you don’t know what those chemicals are or how they affect the human body. All but one of the elements, compounds and minerals you’ve listed are perfectly harmless, at least in the doses you would get off of glazed crockery:
Silica - sand/glass, available as a supplement for hair, nail or bone health
Boron - found in nuts, available as a supplement for bone health, hormone production and protects against heavy metal toxicity
Aluminium - no known risk to human health (it is the third most abundant element on the planet, aluminium is literally everywhere), aluminium is found in some vaccines and medicines
Sodium - essential for human life, affects blood pressure and muscle and nerve function
Iron - essential for human life, used in the creation of red blood cells
Copper - essential for human life, used in the creation of red blood cells
Cobalt - used by the body to help process vitamin B12
Tin - no known natural biological role in humans or animals, but generally harmless
Zirconium - not known to be toxic, although it is an irritant
Barium - perfectly safe, can cause digestive problems if taken in toxic doses
Strontium - available as a supplement, promotes bone growth and health
Lead - the only element on the list which is always toxic to humans, but the use of lead in paints, glazes and clay is against the law in much of the world, so generally would only be found in very small trace amounts these days if at all
Chromium - available as a supplement, helps with insulin production amongst other important functions, safe in trace amounts
Uranium - perfectly safe in trace amounts, there is naturally occurring uranium in the environment all around us and it doesn’t kill us; a banana will be more radioactive than your average piece of china
It’s worth noting, too, there’s a finite amount of these materials in each piece of crockery. For example, if a plate has trace amounts of copper and all of the copper present leeches onto your food over time, there is no longer any copper in the plate.
I couldn’t agree with you more.
Biodegradable bags would be the best option, but if that’s just not feasible what about a scheme similar to a bottle return scheme. Offer Huel in reusable containers, add a reasonable charge for the higher cost of the packaging, and refund the extra charge when the containers are returned, then clean and refill the containers.
I just want to say that I think you and Phil are making exactly the same points. A list of scary chemicals isn’t any use without the research to support any negative side effects in humans. This is exactly what you and Phil are both saying.
The chemicals in question in the shaker (BPA, BPF, BPS) have undergone research, and there is more and more of it but the studies in humans are currently inadequate to reach a conclusion. However this is irrelevant, since we have tested for these 3, and others, and there is no detectable amount.
Please can we keep thread on topic please there are plenty of threads about plastic pouches/recyclable/biodegradable ones/return schemes.
Would it be possible to see more details about these tests? For example was expected wear & tear taken into account from scratching via cutlery (for the H&S pot) and levels of heat you’d get from running the shaker through the dishwasher?
I also think as awareness of the issues surrounding endocrine disrupting chemicals gains traction, more people might benefit from being able to view it in the website FAQ for instance.
exactly this - it is pointless demonising something you see in a list of chemical ingredients and what they do. it is however important to note that when you see a chemical or element in a list it maybe very different to what you think it is; So many of the elements on that list as pointed out in their natural state are perfectly safe within prescribed amounts. Used for other purposes though they are different and also have different health properties. For example:
literally, none of that is correct. Lead is outlawed in things such as paint on children toys etc but is still permitted to be used in glazes, glassware etc providing it less than the levels set by the FDA and other similar bodies. the only perquisites are that they are labelled as such - like with the proposition 65 yellow triangles. This doesn’t mean they are illegal but you are being warned.
Chromium in is pure elemental form is not toxic as you say and is found naturally in some foods and used in supplements. the chromium used in things like stainless steel, glazes, pigments etc is not the same and are referred to as hexaveliant chromium compounds. these are toxic and also proven to be carcinogenic.
so while it should be stressed that you do not demonise something you do not understand - at the same time you shouldn’t assume that something is safe because you believe it to be the same regardless of how it used.
you are also correct about that Adam - the reason I mentioned it specifically for older 20th century pottery. was because in those times it was neither regulated or understood so was used in very unsafe amounts. the reason it was used in glazes and other decorative purposes was for the radium in it which provided luminous clean brightness to colours. you can check out the rather sad story of the Radium Girls who suffered horrible injuries and death from prolonged exposure to these paints while they were decorating watch and clock faces with it.